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Re: New Day New Problems

Posted: 06 May 2016, 12:27
by VPandey
vvmenon wrote:Just read the entire topic - Was wondering how many other AMT users are out there having similar issues? As per Mahindra, around 6kplus AMT TUV's were sold.

I think every TUV unit which comes out of Mahindra factory has something in unique, some has missing parts like AC filters and some with faulty parts, clearly shows that there are no proper systems to check quality of parts supplied by vendors and quality check in assembling unit followed by absolutely no road test or R&D. Actually weak consumer laws and missing regulator guidelines in India gives them a freehand to screw customers and roam free.

New Day New Problems

Posted: 06 May 2016, 12:30
by vvmenon
I had noticed one loose screw in underneath the engine bay, which is almost glued to the surface as the painting job was done with this screw! Asked the SA during service and he said, it's not an "issue"

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Re: New Day New Problems

Posted: 06 May 2016, 12:33
by Sharadkt
vvmenon wrote: I haven't noticed the car accelerating on its own while in B2B traffic.

That is because your AMT is not updated with latest software.

Re: New Day New Problems

Posted: 06 May 2016, 19:03
by vvmenon
Sharadkt wrote:
vvmenon wrote: I haven't noticed the car accelerating on its own while in B2B traffic.

That is because your AMT is not updated with latest software.

Thank god, I was little furious with the SA that he didn't update the software. Think that's a blessing !

Re: RE: Re: New Day New Problems

Posted: 07 May 2016, 21:49
by Sharadkt
vvmenon wrote:
Sharadkt wrote:
vvmenon wrote: I haven't noticed the car accelerating on its own while in B2B traffic.

That is because your AMT is not updated with latest software.

Thank god, I was little furious with the SA that he didn't update the software. Think that's a blessing !

Mahindra zonal heads - technical are to co-test drive mine and Vivek's AMTs next week to decide future course of action. In my case I am simply not giving them any choice but rectify the issues. I will not take delivery of my car until they have solved the issue reported by mine. I will not listen to " this is feature of TUV AMT" crap.

Will post updates here for all of us. Together only we can fight.


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Re: New Day New Problems

Posted: 10 May 2016, 01:26
by Sharadkt

Finally I will be able to take home my TUV300 without worrying... Getting my car back tomorrow post wash.

My brake play had deviated hence there was a delay in physical brake and actual brake or sensor getting activated.

Once corrected ECU is getting immediate signal when to brake rpm or speed etc. So now even if the car maintains RPM at gear shift, just one touch to brake pedal is enough to break that acceleration.

I had after market 3M type mats, which reduced accelerator padel's play to 90%, hence reduced signals were going to ECU, So optimum gears were not slotted by the software, proper torque was not maintained and that impacted the ride quality, AMT behavior and reduced my mileage.

One of us reported TUV AMT stopping in the incline, that was discussed. As per Mr Nikhil it was due to overheating protection getting activated for the AMT clutch, Since it's steep incline and for some reason and in load AMT clutch got overheated so it stopped functioning. After 20 mins with temperature dipped it was back to normal

May be Mahindra needs to find out the reason for clutch overheating, like pending software upgrade, clutch or brake calibration or anything else but unfortunately customer was sent back by the service center.

I had the same mat in last three ECU flashing, during visit from R&D techie, during first service and each time engine knocked but no one noticed. The brake issue was not noticed by any.

It all points to one thing - lack of training and knowledge transfer by Mahindra to dealership. Dealership service engineer are as clue less about AMT tech as a customer in distress.

The all sensors calibration should be part of ECU flashing SOP to avoid each customer having different issues post upgrade.

Why should a service engineer return back a customer reporting AMT failure during steep incline just because there is no error code stored in ECU while Mahindra technical team immediately pointed out clutch plate overheating as the culprit. Which means dealership people do not even know all features and tech involved in AMT.

The fault clearly lies with Mahindra, due to their lack of knowledge transfer and training initiatives dealership people are helpless and get a bad reputation as well.

This inconvenienced and completely blew my sanity for past one week, but finally I can relax now. May be if not dealership, train us - your customers Mahindra!

We should know how to use AMT in most optimum way, whenever something happens why it happened and what not to do or what to do.

This is in the best interest of Mahindra too.

By the way latest ECU flashing is category red so all TUVs will be recalled.


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Re: New Day New Problems

Posted: 10 May 2016, 10:57
by vvmenon
Good to know that the issues are sorted out and tank is back at home.

It is a known fact that the service dealership doesn't know much about the technology. Issues - resolution is still a hit or miss with service centres. Mahindra needs to invest more on knowledge transfer.

Now on the after market accessories - good to know about the mat related issue. I read somewhere a TUV got fire, due to wrong placing of crash guard. After market accessories causing issues are not isolated to Mahindra, but all manufacturers. I still remember my Indica Xeta refusing to start and the issue was identified to a bad installation of music system. After that, I have never installed any after market accessory in any of my cars - whatever I need, I try to get it fixed before delivery from showroom itself.

I may be going to service centre sometime this week to fix the issue related to rattling sound from right hand side driver door (known manufacturing issue with almost all TUVs). Need to check on my software too.

Re: New Day New Problems

Posted: 11 May 2016, 09:20
by VPandey
Update to the problems reported:

As per prior schedule of test drive of my TUV by Mr Santhanam (Zonal Head - North West Customer Care), I went to Sterling Motor Company service centre at around 4.30 PM. I started explaining problems being faced and meanwhile technicians adjusted the break play as reported in Sharad's TUV.

First Problem:
It was around a 10 km test drive where I explained him about a jerk while downshifting from 2nd to 1st gear, which he also noticed and feedback taken as an input for technical team to come up with any possible solution.

Second Problem:
I had reported a slow pickup sometimes followed by a jerk or sudden clutch release in slow traffic movement. Which fortunately happened once while Mr Santhanam was driving but he refused to accept as a problem and started giving excuses about this happened due to he shifted from manual to auto mode and blah blah...!

Third Problem:
Increased RPM for about 2-3 seconds while gear upshifts and you feel you need to break suddenly in the middle of shifting in AMT mode. Problem could not be simulated as they had adjusted break play and problem may have vanished due to that.

Fourth Problem:
Unwanted slow jerks or slow pulling pushing in low speeds while driving in 1st or 2nd gear, also while braking downshifts are not smooth. Problem is still there and inconsistency is noticed in slow speeds but unfortunately its almost impossible to simulate problem every time when you feel to repeat, so despite of feeling the problems he denied noticing any such behaviour.

Then we test drove a test drive and a brand new vehicle as well and notice first problem is standard across all TUV AMTs. But those TUVs were a bit smooth while in low speeds in comparison of mine.

After test drives we had a discussion session of around 1 hour, where he explained characteristics of AMT and why customers need to be educated for handling of AMT. He also mentioned that in AMTs auto mode is not suppose to be used while driving in hills, as it could overheat the clutch system, resulting in early burning of clutch plates. When I asked him about why customer is being made responsible for clutch plates burning in AMT models when there is no clutch pedal, he replied since no other companies offer such warranty and people can abuse clutch system in many ways (like driving AMT with both feets - one on break and other on accelerator) thats why we also do not offer such warranty. But assured of all possible help in any such condition.

TUV being jerky in slow speeds - It has been reported by almost all reviewers and customers too but it seems Mahindra is reluctant to accept that as a problem and classifying it as an AMT behaviour, whereas AMT from other competitors are way better than what we have in TUV. But Mahindra is overconfident by its success of Scorpio and XUV and despite of knowing that how customers suffered in early days of these models, they feel things will stabilise over a period of time, overlooking the difference in the presence of social media then and now.

Best of Luck Mahindra !!

Re: New Day New Problems

Posted: 11 May 2016, 09:39
by Sharadkt
Closure mail received from Mahindra

Dear Mr. Tater,


This is with reference to your post on social media followed by our discussion about TUV bearing Reg # MH-04-GZ-8604. Since the said concern was related to the AMT, we had requested our Technical Expert to inspect your vehicle yesterday. 

During our joint inspection, we could reproduce the concern. We could also found out the root cause of the concern which was due to the external fitment done by you in your vehicle. It was observed that you had laid 8mm thick aftermarket matting on floor and nearly 2 to 3 mm thick carpet lamination in your vehicle. Due to its thickness, it was restricting the movement of accelerator pedal travel. Post removal of these extra mattings & carpet lamination, we did a test drive of the vehicle with you & found the performance satisfactory.

It is needless to mention that there was no manufacturing defect observed in your vehicle. We request you to use only genuine accessories to get the optimum performance of your vehicle. The adverse effect of using non-genuine accessories was brought to your notice during a joint inspection and road test taken with you.

I would also like to advise you to remove the additional part fitted in the suspension system from the local market. It will affect vehicle dynamics.

Please feel free to call me in case of any further clarification / assistance and we will be pleased to assist you.

Wishing you a happy and safe motoring!

Warm regards,

Re: New Day New Problems

Posted: 11 May 2016, 09:40
by Sharadkt
Closure mail sent to Mahindra

Dear Mangesh,

Thanks to you, entire support team from Mahindra & GG team for taking this on priority. It is quite a disappointment that root cause was a thick mat set and it could cause such grave inconvenience and stress to all of us. After removing the same the TUV AMT behaves fine, the concern raised by me are solved to my satisfaction.

The spoiler, side skirting, mud flap and 2-3 mm thick carpet lamination mentioned in your mail is unfortunately from the company showroom only and I have the receipt. Point is no one else other than Mahindra technician knows about it being an issue or creates an issue in TUV functioning.

The mat set is in the TUV from first week of TUV purchase, since that it has been to service centre at least 10-15 times, stayed in workshop for weeks, there was visit from R&D person, dealership technician, there was first service done but again no one asked me to remove this thick 8mm mat set.

Once more the point made by me is no one including customer or dealership technician knows these things. I would like to call them TUV secrets or hidden features. No one knows about clutch plate heat protection being built in TUV and we simply call it #TUVAMTFAIL on twitter, as we don't know its a feature, instead we get so scared that TUV AMT can fail on hills and could result in serious highway accident.

When do you plan to pass on this knowledge to dealership so that they can better handle our issues and we don't waste time in escalating to Mahindra and waiting for your highly skilled plant and R&D technicians. Just imagine the time wasted on twitter, online and on the phone escalating and explaining the concerns and feeling so pathetic about our buying decisions. It drained us as customers emotionally and mentally. If it wasn't India you would be dealing with lawsuits causing grave stress to your customer.

Coming to your advice on local (by the way it is imported from Taiwan under valid import license) part in suspension, I will remove the same once you acknowledge and work on suspension issues reported by me to you. The suspension is so soft and causes violent body roll on uneven roads, speed breakers. It causes motion sickness in my kids, back ache to my parents and is dangerous to my father who is operated with Total Hip Replacement. Excessive vertical body roll can cause hip dislocation to him.

I have tried to explain this to dealership service advisors as well as to you verbally but none understood forget working on it or even mentioning it in the work order opened. I hope you would agree that vehicles should be kids friendly, senior citizen friendly and disable friendly. I can't abandon kids or parents for your vehicle's suspension feature. If you fine it local, please provide such suspension modulation parts yourself making it genuine Mahindra parts. Kindly advice what is to be done in this case?

Do share this with your technical expert Mr. Nikhil, I purposely disclosed the local / imported part in suspension for him to take away something from the 3-4 hours of his time with customer. I was sure, my request to try to reduce RPM levels in 2nd to 3rd gear shift, jerk felt couple of times when braking and sudden loss of power in higher gears will go completely as not worthy to even note or mention and utmost important local suspension part will grab his intellect instantly.

So for the CRM, you can close the case, my concerns are solved to my satisfaction, product is behaving perfectly normal within specification and yes no manufacturing defect to the vehicle or AMT what so ever, customer has to be educated via youtube videos.

Long mail, many days of agony, finally once again I have a personal vehicle.

Thanks & Regards,